It is being considered. Can't say more yet, though.XGeneral2000 wrote:
I wonder, would it be possible to add a score's pp value to the client? So we could see the pp contribution to every score in-game?Tom94 wrote:
Your 10 best scores are listed in your profile in the "Top Ranks" tab.
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Performance Points feedback and suggestions (Standard)
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Topic Starter
I'm really satisfied with the new system. I felt as a pp farmer in the previous one but now its just about perfectly placed me and almost every others (imo) on our small country ranking. Good job!
Liiraye, I don't think this system takes your rank on the song into consideration. It may take relativity in consideration (like older versions of ppv2) but just because you set a highscore/ top 15 on a song does not mean it's considered your most skillful play. And if you don't consider them some of your best plays, it IS a new system. Don't expect perfection yet. It looks great as it is so far but I expect a lot of tweaking for the next few months
I've spent more than a few hundred tries (not all at once of course) to FC that HR map, but managed to do DT in around 15Tom94 wrote:
As for the HR rank vs your DT rank. I believe they are both very good and will keep tweaking the difficulty algorithm. It's hard to calll one of them both better than the other with good reasoning.
I really believe it's because of very small circles which makes you miss a lot more often (it's CS6 with HR)
Ah, btw I forgot mentioning TAG maps
It's probably hard to take them into a count, but I'd like to see this tweaked too
I just played a beatmap from 'best performance' tab and while passing it on hd and getting rank #5600~ (was #6400~ before no mods) I lost 1 pp. Is it normal?
Just a question: will the new PP difficulty algorithm be replacing the current in-game star difficulty rating in the future?
And is there any way to integrate this with the client for beatmaps existing/already downloaded? So we can sort by difficulty in song select and it would be accurate?YayMii wrote:
Just a question: will the new PP difficulty algorithm be replacing the current in-game star difficulty rating in the future?
Or is that what you meant?
Will there be an update to the current ingame or website UI in order to integrate the PP metrics?
What i mean is:
- A number before the map's title in the "Best Performance" section that shows how much pp you got from a play;
- An expansion to the "Best Performance" section (10 plays isn't that much);
- A way to see the "difficulty line" regarding to one or the other mod (i.e. to see how "hard" the song is if i play it with DT);
- A way to see how much pp you got from a particular play in game;
- A way to "sort" records by pp (like you can do it now - by country or by particular mod);
Basically most of the things the osu!tp has now.
Sorry for my english in advance.
What i mean is:
- A number before the map's title in the "Best Performance" section that shows how much pp you got from a play;
- An expansion to the "Best Performance" section (10 plays isn't that much);
- A way to see the "difficulty line" regarding to one or the other mod (i.e. to see how "hard" the song is if i play it with DT);
- A way to see how much pp you got from a particular play in game;
- A way to "sort" records by pp (like you can do it now - by country or by particular mod);
Basically most of the things the osu!tp has now.
Sorry for my english in advance.
I haven't browsed the thread, so most of this has probably already been said, but here's my thoughts.
I like this system a lot more than the old system. I dropped from around rank 57k to 94k, so I'm not a very skilled player like most people here. But my 57k rank was very flawed. Almost all of my pp under the old system came from a single old map that hardly anyone was able to full combo (not because of difficulty, but from the poor quality of the map). It was also nearly impossible for me to ever gain any ranks since I couldn't get high enough ranks on songs unless I played maps that were not very commonly played.
This seems to be remedied now, as several of my top performances were not on the list before because they were as low as rank #5000 on the song or lower. I feel some of these were truly my "best performances", even though they are on more popular maps, and it is really nice to see them factoring into the calculations now.
I don't care about a specific number for my ranking, but seeing as it's potentially easier for someone of my skill to go up in rankings, this should give me more motivation to get better since I can see actual progress now. Keep up the good work!
I like this system a lot more than the old system. I dropped from around rank 57k to 94k, so I'm not a very skilled player like most people here. But my 57k rank was very flawed. Almost all of my pp under the old system came from a single old map that hardly anyone was able to full combo (not because of difficulty, but from the poor quality of the map). It was also nearly impossible for me to ever gain any ranks since I couldn't get high enough ranks on songs unless I played maps that were not very commonly played.
This seems to be remedied now, as several of my top performances were not on the list before because they were as low as rank #5000 on the song or lower. I feel some of these were truly my "best performances", even though they are on more popular maps, and it is really nice to see them factoring into the calculations now.
I don't care about a specific number for my ranking, but seeing as it's potentially easier for someone of my skill to go up in rankings, this should give me more motivation to get better since I can see actual progress now. Keep up the good work!
Osu! TP map level underneath the beatmap name + AR/OD/HP stats.
Just like this just underneath the beatmap ingame ^
Example :
Tom94BESTDJEU - PEPPY NEW PP RANKING(=BEST!) [Tom94 remix]
OD: 10 HP : 8 AR : 10 CS : XXX Aim : XXX Speed : xxx
BPM : xxx circles : xxx sliders : xxx spinners : xxx
Just like this just underneath the beatmap ingame ^
Example :
Tom94BESTDJEU - PEPPY NEW PP RANKING(=BEST!) [Tom94 remix]
OD: 10 HP : 8 AR : 10 CS : XXX Aim : XXX Speed : xxx
BPM : xxx circles : xxx sliders : xxx spinners : xxx
If they were to implement that I would imagine it would come with the redesign of he profile pages peppy said he was working on.
Really liking the new pp!
I think though, beatmaps with really high bpm (the 280 blob and scarlet rose and such) are being undervalued in terms of "beatmap difficulty"
Just what I feel, especially like how the top ranks reflect your "personal achievements" a bit more instead of showing just all your boring mod-SS (at least at my level)
Keep it up!
I think though, beatmaps with really high bpm (the 280 blob and scarlet rose and such) are being undervalued in terms of "beatmap difficulty"
Just what I feel, especially like how the top ranks reflect your "personal achievements" a bit more instead of showing just all your boring mod-SS (at least at my level)
Keep it up!
ItHR still have a over value?
Lets have Thelewa for example: He is really good Hr Hd but he don't have so much speed and DT accuracy as SnowWhite, Dungeon or DragonHuman.
I Respect Thelewa. But still think he don't deserve 3#
Lets have Thelewa for example: He is really good Hr Hd but he don't have so much speed and DT accuracy as SnowWhite, Dungeon or DragonHuman.
I Respect Thelewa. But still think he don't deserve 3#
This new system seems really good and pretty accurate. The only one weird thing that I've found is that I had a top rank on a map, which I didn't even full combo so I replayed it and full combo'ed it with HD on and improved the score greatly but then the map actually disappeared from my top rank suggesting my new score was actually worse than before.
EDIT: Seems like there is just a delay now for the system to display the top ranks. After a while, the song came back onto a higher place on my top ranks which was expected.
EDIT: Seems like there is just a delay now for the system to display the top ranks. After a while, the song came back onto a higher place on my top ranks which was expected.
So far I love the new PP system.
Would need to wait a little to see if there's anything wrong with it, any flaws...
We'll have a better idea of what needs to be changed or not in a few month I guess.
Would need to wait a little to see if there's anything wrong with it, any flaws...
We'll have a better idea of what needs to be changed or not in a few month I guess.
Even if I went from 10.8K to #30.3K, I knew I didn't deserve that high rank.
Pretty accurate (at least what is showing in my top ranks). Some Insane I struggled a bit to FC are there, so I'm quite happy with the actual outcome, though there is a score with crappy accuracy (85.89%) and far far away from being a FC as my best performace, so I think it'd still take some time to fully update?
Pretty accurate (at least what is showing in my top ranks). Some Insane I struggled a bit to FC are there, so I'm quite happy with the actual outcome, though there is a score with crappy accuracy (85.89%) and far far away from being a FC as my best performace, so I think it'd still take some time to fully update?
but if u get less accuracy than before ur rank goes upPurple wrote:
Only if you beat your old scoredukambe wrote:
Rank on user profile not the same as rank on performance page/country page, which i guess is because of some hidden players. (Example: dragonhuman #8 and #4 country on profile, #6 on performance and #2 on country page)
Also what happens if i get a higher performance on a song where i already had a ranking. Just for example if i have HD+HR on Remote Control and then DT fc it, would the DT fc count?
Topic Starter
What osu!tp has been doing is not working that easily here, since the processor has to deal with far more than 100times as many scores. A per-score pp display is being considered, ingame and in the web. I'll probably propose an ingame difficulty display, incorporating mods, at some point as well when I have time.ohyou wrote:
Will there be an update to the current ingame or website UI in order to integrate the PP metrics?
What i mean is:
- A number before the map's title in the "Best Performance" section that shows how much pp you got from a play;
- An expansion to the "Best Performance" section (10 plays isn't that much);
- A way to see the "difficulty line" regarding to one or the other mod (i.e. to see how "hard" the song is if i play it with DT);
- A way to see how much pp you got from a particular play in game;
- A way to "sort" records by pp (like you can do it now - by country or by particular mod);
Basically most of the things the osu!tp has now.
Sorry for my english in advance.
TAG4 maps will be fixed as soon as per-hitobject data is available. Before that there is not much I can do due to the extreme difficulty spikes.Kert wrote:
I've spent more than a few hundred tries (not all at once of course) to FC that HR map, but managed to do DT in around 15Tom94 wrote:
As for the HR rank vs your DT rank. I believe they are both very good and will keep tweaking the difficulty algorithm. It's hard to calll one of them both better than the other with good reasoning.
I really believe it's because of very small circles which makes you miss a lot more often (it's CS6 with HR)
Ah, btw I forgot mentioning TAG maps
It's probably hard to take them into a count, but I'd like to see this tweaked too
Also let me repeat what I said in the other thread for everyone:
Just a quick note for everyone who experiences a big drop in ranks. In the previous pp system players who were inactive were not counted. This is not added to the new system yet, so please wait a little while. Your rank drop might not be that bad - potentially it even rose?
That's exactly what I meant. The new difficulty algorithm rating isRaneFire wrote:
And is there any way to integrate this with the client for beatmaps existing/already downloaded? So we can sort by difficulty in song select and it would be accurate?YayMii wrote:
Just a question: will the new PP difficulty algorithm be replacing the current in-game star difficulty rating in the future?
Or is that what you meant?
. I wanna see them in game.
Doge_old_1
R e d wrote:
ItHR still have a over value?
Lets have Thelewa for example: He is really good Hr Hd but he don't have so much speed and DT accuracy as SnowWhite, Dungeon or DragonHuman.
I Respect Thelewa. But still think he don't deserve 3#
It depends a lot really. Some maps that are practically impossible to aim propely that only a handful of players can hdhr deserves pp as well. Don't you agree?
Speed isn't everything you know!
I think this is a lot more fair than old pp system. One thing I wanted to say is that some scores are overestimated: my score on this map: http://osu.ppy.sh/b/338594&m=0 is 300 combo (with over 800 full combo) and 84,44% acc. Because it's fresh map I have #84, and probably for that reason it landed in my Top Ranks. I wouldn't consider this a good score, so I wonder why it's so high performance.
Also, because of that single score, my overall acc fell from 95,51% to 95,15%, which isn't cool :/
Also, because of that single score, my overall acc fell from 95,51% to 95,15%, which isn't cool :/
What about calculating accuracy with unstable rate? Or is it that hard to calculate on every map played?.
I don't think it is possible since I don't think there is enough information stored to retrieve that value exactly.Salvage wrote:
What about considering accuracy with unstable rate? Or is it that hard to calculate on every map played?.
It can be estimated though, as long as you ignore sliders (since sliders can potentially increase UR without reducing accuracy, since they don't need to be hit accurately).
DT is better for pp, as FL. If i haв highscore with DT, but i've broken my old DT-record with FL, my old reord must be deleted from base and i lose pp, isn't it?
For exampe, WoobWoofWolf has his the best record for "Saiya - Remote Control" beatmap now. He has 5 misses, but he used DT+HD mode. But SnowWhite played this map without DT, with HD+HR, have FC, but doesn't have this map for Best Perfomance. If WoobWoofWolf plays now map without mods and break his own records, he loses old records and loses pp.
So, best score for beatmap is not best pp. It is better to use DT and don't play other mods without DT. Is it wrong?
update: I see answer in next post now, thank you.
For exampe, WoobWoofWolf has his the best record for "Saiya - Remote Control" beatmap now. He has 5 misses, but he used DT+HD mode. But SnowWhite played this map without DT, with HD+HR, have FC, but doesn't have this map for Best Perfomance. If WoobWoofWolf plays now map without mods and break his own records, he loses old records and loses pp.
So, best score for beatmap is not best pp. It is better to use DT and don't play other mods without DT. Is it wrong?
update: I see answer in next post now, thank you.
Topic Starter
The score rank you get on a map does not matter at all for the new pp. Only your performance together with the beatmap difficulty counts. Maybe the map was really hard? I've seen a C in jesus1412's best performance list and it was a crazy hard DT score, about as hard as FCing mendes with DoubleTime. I'll take a look what's happening with your scores, though.Wojowu wrote:
I think this is a lot more fair than old pp system. One thing I wanted to say is that some scores are overestimated: my score on this map: http://osu.ppy.sh/b/338594&m=0 is 300 combo (with over 800 full combo) and 84,44% acc. Because it's fresh map I have #84, and probably for that reason it landed in my Top Ranks. I wouldn't consider this a good score, so I wonder why it's so high performance.
Also, because of that single score, my overall acc fell from 95,51% to 95,15%, which isn't cool :/
thelewa only makes us believe he'd be slow. He 99.5%ed Chipscape! That's not slow. His top scores might not be the fastest, but they are an amazing combination of speed, aim and acc. That being said it doesn't mean, that you are wrong. I am just mentioning it.R e d wrote:
ItHR still have a over value?
Lets have Thelewa for example: He is really good Hr Hd but he don't have so much speed and DT accuracy as SnowWhite, Dungeon or DragonHuman.
I Respect Thelewa. But still think he don't deserve 3#
Score improvements won't always benefit your pp. On a map which is really hard to DT beating your DT score with HR might actually reduce your pp. This is currently a limitation I wish there wouldn't be, but it exists.UE95 wrote:
Will my pp benefit in any shape or form if I keep improving my previous scores? Also, does it have to be a drastic improvement? I'm really sorry if these are dumb questions, I'm just a bit overwhelmed by this new system :/
Something similar to unstable rate is used. OD does play a huge role. We are already considering, to update the accuracy displayed in the player profiles to a more sensible measure, while maybe keeping the old value in parantheses.Salvage wrote:
What about calculating accuracy with unstable rate? Or is it that hard to calculate on every map played?.
Topic Starter
You are correct. I wish this limitation wouldn't exist, but there is no possibility of changing it for the moment.MosaicII wrote:
DT is better for pp, as FL. If i haв highscore with DT, but i've broken my old DT-record with FL, my old reord must be deleted from base and i lose pp, isn't it?
For exampe, WoobWoofWolf has his the best record for "Saiya - Remote Control" beatmap now. He has 5 misses, but he used DT+HD mode. But SnowWhite played this map without DT, with HD+HR, have FC, but doesn't have this map for Best Perfomance. If WoobWoofWolf plays now map without mods and break his own records, he loses old records and loses pp.
So, best score for beatmap is not best pp. It is better to use DT and don't play other mods without DT. Is it wrong?
Full Tablet wrote:
I don't think it is possible since I don't think there is enough information stored to retrieve that value exactly.Salvage wrote:
What about considering accuracy with unstable rate? Or is it that hard to calculate on every map played?.
It can be estimated though, as long as you ignore sliders (since sliders can potentially increase UR without reducing accuracy, since they don't need to be hit accurately).
Including sliders, that was my point, but well i guess it can't be done.
Oh, ninja'd .. glad to hear that then tom
.
Topic Starter
Sliders and spinners already are ignored for the part of the calculation that is responsible for accuracy. But yeah, in the end it only is an approximation of unstable rate due to per-hitobject data not being available.Full Tablet wrote:
I don't think it is possible since I don't think there is enough information stored to retrieve that value exactly.Salvage wrote:
What about considering accuracy with unstable rate? Or is it that hard to calculate on every map played?.
It can be estimated though, as long as you ignore sliders (since sliders can potentially increase UR without reducing accuracy, since they don't need to be hit accurately).
I went from rank 15k to rank 9k. That's...something. I guess it's because I tried really hard to do well on harder songs and didn't farm normal/hards very much at all?
The old ppv1 system had the same issue. A solution would be storing "best performances" separately from "best scores", but the problem is that would be expensive in term of server resources; and if the system has time degradation of scores, it wouldn't solve the problem in all cases (depending in how the degradation is implemented)MosaicII wrote:
DT is better for pp, as FL. If i haв highscore with DT, but i've broken my old DT-record with FL, my old reord must be deleted from base and i lose pp, isn't it?
For exampe, WoobWoofWolf has his the best record for "Saiya - Remote Control" beatmap now. He has 5 misses, but he used DT+HD mode. But SnowWhite played this map without DT, with HD+HR, have FC, but doesn't have this map for Best Perfomance. If WoobWoofWolf plays now map without mods and break his own records, he loses old records and loses pp.
So, best score for beatmap is not best pp. It is better to use DT and don't play other mods without DT. Is it wrong?
Not sure if this belongs here but I'll ask anyway.
Are there plans on fixing the star star sytem by replacing it with the beatmap difficulty level?
Are there plans on fixing the star star sytem by replacing it with the beatmap difficulty level?
I'm not sure if I'm understand the "all scores are used" thing, but tell me if I'm right with this example:
Score 1: 10,000,000 score, played on normal, FC 100%.
Score 2: 3,000,000 score, played on DT/HD, had 1 miss. 99%.
My best score would show up as Score 1, but my best "performance" would probably be from Score 2, so the PP I get from Score 2 would count for my PP ranking?
Score 1: 10,000,000 score, played on normal, FC 100%.
Score 2: 3,000,000 score, played on DT/HD, had 1 miss. 99%.
My best score would show up as Score 1, but my best "performance" would probably be from Score 2, so the PP I get from Score 2 would count for my PP ranking?
That sure sounds like a nice idea, considering all the maps already have a difficulty rating calculated by the system.kreph wrote:
Not sure if this belongs here but I'll ask anyway.
Are there plans on fixing the star star sytem by replacing it with the beatmap difficulty level?
All scores being used means that it doesn't have the limitation that tp had where it could only access top 50 score data. PPv2 has access to ranks beyond top 50 which is why they say all scores are used.Izzypookins wrote:
I'm not sure if I'm understand the "all scores are used" thing, but tell me if I'm right with this example:
Score 1: 10,000,000 score, played on normal, FC 100%.
Score 2: 3,000,000 score, played on DT/HD, had 1 miss. 99%.
My best score would show up as Score 1, but my best "performance" would probably be from Score 2, so the PP I get from Score 2 would count for my PP ranking?
Topic Starter
If both scores are on the same map, then the higher score value gets used, even if the other would give more pp. As I mentioned earlier we can not work around this at the moment.Izzypookins wrote:
I'm not sure if I'm understand the "all scores are used" thing, but tell me if I'm right with this example:
Score 1: 10,000,000 score, played on normal, FC 100%.
Score 2: 3,000,000 score, played on DT/HD, had 1 miss. 99%.
My best score would show up as Score 1, but my best "performance" would probably be from Score 2, so the PP I get from Score 2 would count for my PP ranking?
If those 2 scores are on different maps, then how much pp you will get highly depends on how hard the maps are.
Got it! Thanks!Tom94 wrote:
If both scores are on the same map, then the higher score value gets used, even if the other would give more pp. As I mentioned earlier we can not work around this at the moment.Izzypookins wrote:
I'm not sure if I'm understand the "all scores are used" thing, but tell me if I'm right with this example:
Score 1: 10,000,000 score, played on normal, FC 100%.
Score 2: 3,000,000 score, played on DT/HD, had 1 miss. 99%.
My best score would show up as Score 1, but my best "performance" would probably be from Score 2, so the PP I get from Score 2 would count for my PP ranking?
If those 2 scores are on different maps, then how much pp you will get highly depends on how hard the maps are.
Is it just me or mods aren't affecting too much in the new pp ranking?
well, i think the current system is the closest to perfect ~ time to