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Removing success rate stats.

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Total Posts
36
This is a feature request. Feature requests can be voted up by supporters.
Current Priority: +71
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Topic Starter
Wishy


This stat is useless and misguiding. On most cases you get a low success rate even when the map is easy since most people retry/wait until fail because they missed and they wanted a full combo. Plus you can get tons of fails/retries because FL players, DT players retrying a lot too, same with every other mod. Meaning you can get a really low success rate even on a very easy map.

Then again you got very hard maps like FREEDOM DiVE where the success rate is actually ridiculously high since truth is that map has been cleared no more than 5 times (I'm pretty sure of this), and most clears are because of no fail/half time/easy, which doesn't really make any sense.

Plus, some maps have a very low HP Leech, so even when they may be completely insane, clearing wouldn't be much of a challenge.

Examples:

http://osu.ppy.sh/b/129891&m=0

Success rate on Another is almost the same as FOUR DIMENSIONS, one being just a very tiring stream map, while the other is by far the hardest map ever ranked.

http://osu.ppy.sh/s/24313 and http://osu.ppy.sh/s/48979

Airman has a higher success rate, and it's obviously WAY HARDER. But:

On Airman most people don't even try to FC and play it just for fun, HP Leech is low so clearing isn't that hard. Meanwhile, Mythologia's HP Leech is higher, you got lots of streams meaning some epic fail on any of those means failing. Plus it's actually possible to FC/easy to get a high combo on so you may get lots of retries/intentional fails after a miss.

tl;dr: Misguiding data and almost useless since it doesn't really say anything, and you can get a better reference of how hard the map is by looking at the top scores.
Leechertyper
2 posts
Joined July 2012
Leechertyper
I feel they should go with Score Distribution
deadbeat
osu! Alumni
9,218 posts
Joined June 2009
deadbeat
might be interesting having it as a personal statistic somewhere
Kuro
836 posts
Joined July 2012
Kuro

Wishy wrote:



This stat is useless
It doesn't even show anything when you click taiko so I'm pretty sure the entire taiko community wouldn't care what happens to it.
XPJ38
osu! Alumni
3,570 posts
Joined February 2010
XPJ38
I support.
My two cents: Points of Failure graph should be removed as well because it's also quite useless. I mean, I'm pretty sure that the majority of people don't look at it.
Aqo
2,710 posts
Joined April 2010
Aqo
I also agree that this graph is quite possibly the most useless thing ever for anybody who knows how this game works and it does no more than to mislead beginners. Removing it would trim away unnecessary clutter.
Flanster
5,938 posts
Joined August 2010
Flanster
It could be replaced by map rating IF removed that is.
Aqo
2,710 posts
Joined April 2010
Aqo
Map rating is just as useless and should be removed as well :b

The fact that map rating is actually *mapset rating* makes no sense since every map in a mapset is completely different and often even made by different mappers with completely different styles, and yet people get to vote after playing only one map; there is also the fact that if people didn't perform well on a map it's because they didn't understand it well, so they'll end up rating it only by the song and not by the quality of the map itself. If map rating was per-map based (as opposed to per-mapset) and you were only allowed to vote after getting at least an A rank (A/S/SS) on the map, only then it would remotely make sense. As of right now it's a useless stat as well.
theowest
osu! Alumni
6,891 posts
Joined January 2009
theowest

Lolicore Flandre wrote:

It could be replaced by map rating IF removed that is.
Difficulty specific rating? nope
TheVileOne
osu! Alumni
8,431 posts
Joined March 2010
TheVileOne
You shouldn't suggest removing useless stats. They are useless, there is no benefit to having them removed, and even if there was a possibility of there being a use, that would be more beneficial to keep it there instead of removing it.

Besides it isn't useless, you can tell where most people fail on a song. Also if more people fail than retry. That stat obviously wont be perfectly accurate but it sure isn't so inaccurate that the results would be wrong in 90% of cases. Edge cases don't matter, because such a system can never be perfect, so stop complaining about the edge cases being misleading.
MillhioreF
Pro Tester
5,004 posts
Joined July 2011
MillhioreF
I'm gonna have to agree with TheVileOne - it isn't COMPLETELY useless. As long as it has a small use (it tells where most people fail or retry) then there's no reason to remove it for the sake of removing it.

Of course, if we get some better, more important information, then that would be a good reason to consider removing it for the sake of space to fit the new information in. This doesn't seem to be the case at the moment, though.
theowest
osu! Alumni
6,891 posts
Joined January 2009
theowest
so let's improve it.
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Topic Starter
Wishy

TheVileOne wrote:

You shouldn't suggest removing useless stats. They are useless, there is no benefit to having them removed, and even if there was a possibility of there being a use, that would be more beneficial to keep it there instead of removing it.

Besides it isn't useless, you can tell where most people fail on a song. Also if more people fail than retry. That stat obviously wont be perfectly accurate but it sure isn't so inaccurate that the results would be wrong in 90% of cases. Edge cases don't matter, because such a system can never be perfect, so stop complaining about the edge cases being misleading.
It is a problem because it is misguiding, according to success rate data every map, even easy ones.

People sometime just stop playing until fail when they miss. Only use you can get from that graph is "where the hard part is", but then again I don't really know anyone who actually looks at that. It's almost useless and misguiding.

AR is still missing, both In-Game and on beatmaps pages.
Hiryuu_old
439 posts
Joined June 2011
Hiryuu_old
+1 support

When I started playing osu! on 2011.. back when I used to browse for songs before I gained supporter, I saw that there was a graph there but I never really saw it to be any use of information towards me even as a beginner. I used to think that yeah, that graph doesn't tell me anything..so I just downloaded the song and saw it for myself if it's right for me to practice on it or not.
Also, I'm quite certain that most users who have supporter don't even look at the graph nor care about it (I don't). If anything, then maybe some users do who like to observe it, but I don't think the majority do.
SunBurn
28 posts
Joined June 2012
SunBurn
Excellent post!
Support from me!
winber1
4,520 posts
Joined February 2010
winber1
... what success rate?

does it even exist
theowest
osu! Alumni
6,891 posts
Joined January 2009
theowest

winber1 wrote:

... what success rate?

does it even exist
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Topic Starter
Wishy
Apparently that map is really easy to clear. :s
TheVileOne
osu! Alumni
8,431 posts
Joined March 2010
TheVileOne
Apparently 4 percent success rate is considered easy to clear to some people. Remember that's 4 percent of plays in general. These plays can be from the same people.
jemhuntr
933 posts
Joined February 2012
jemhuntr
But if i'm a beginner, I'll think that a 4% success rate is so low. And that makes me think that 96% plays are fails, even if around 80% of those plays are actually just retries.
Success rate shouldn't include retries and quits since technically, you didn't fail in those conditions.

Apparently people adapt to the environment. Having this system for so long made people adapt to how it currently works, so old players think it's normal, but new players would think it's weird.
TheVileOne
osu! Alumni
8,431 posts
Joined March 2010
TheVileOne
I think in the OP's example 92 percent are fails and the other 4 percent is retries.

I agree though, showing only fails would be a more accurate depiction of difficulty.

Anyways if we're talking about useless panels here, I think the rating spread graph is a lot more useless than this. The rating spread graph doesn't even have numbers attached to it. It should be removed before this panel.
Winshley
osu! Alumni
2,384 posts
Joined May 2011
Winshley
The only stats that is being used here is how many time players have played into the map. You can see the "[Artist] - [Song Title] [Diff Name] has been played 10,000 times!" at #announce channel. Maybe it's just to show you which map is being mainstream right now... :lol:

Also, the Success Rate is already per difficulty-specific, not per mapset.

TheVileOne wrote:

Anyways if we're talking about useless panels here, I think the rating spread graph is a lot more useless than this. The rating spread graph doesn't even have numbers attached to it. It should be removed before this panel.
We don't even get to see how many players have voted the map, though the "Like/Dislike" spread already showed you.
Last edited by Winshley , edited 1 time in total.
jemhuntr
933 posts
Joined February 2012
jemhuntr
Hell, I don't even know how that user ratings are computed. I man that red-green bars on top of rating spread.
winber1
4,520 posts
Joined February 2010
winber1

theowest wrote:

winber1 wrote:

... what success rate?

does it even exist
there is something called sarcasm; you might have heard of it.
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