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 Rhythm Incarnate 2,492 posts   |
Slider anchors/nodes must not be used to manipulate slider speeds (whether they are normal nodes or red ones). Using extra nodes to make a slider "wiggle" is usually fine, but using so many that the slider gets scrunched up (which also makes the sliderball go crazy) or become a "hold slider" is abuse of the hitobject's intended use and is not allowed. AIMod (shortcut ctrl+shift+a) will also point out sliders that move in an "abnormal" way, so make sure to check that if you're unsure of a slider. This rule is confusing to me. What is its purpose? Are we banning/limiting the use of crumpled sliders in any way? I do not have a suggestion yet to clarify this rule, so please discuss. If it would help, give me an example of an unrankable slider according to this rule. |
 Rhythm Incarnate 2,141 posts |
This sort of thing seems to tie in with sliders overlapping themselves. However, in effective use, the number of people that consider it unrankable are split fairly evenly - it's a very viable thing to do if the music fits, but is often used poorly and in a manner that's hard to read (especially with the superior mmsliders)
In my personal opinion, it's a viable mapping technique that just needs people to pay closer attention to them to make sure they're not poorly done. (pretty much like any other technique. If you can manage to have something like 1/2 slider -> 1/1 slider wiggled to the same length as the 1/2, I would 100% suggest that you have tick rate 2 (based off THE REST OF THE MAP) to make it even more readable. MoonFragrance is a huge user of this technique and he executes it perfectly more often than not. Suggestion: scrap rule entirely, possibly leave a note in guidelines to older/non-new mappers that the technique is now okay within reason. |
 Beatmap Appreciation Team 7,717 posts   |
Crumpled sliders are not unrankable as they are, more like making them waaaaay too crumpled makes them unrankable because it becomes extremely slow and is a way around the slider speed limit that prevents hold sliders, as the rule says AIMod will catch any slider of these, so if AIMod says nothing, it's probably ok
and even if they do heal the scar will remain and nothing will ever be the same |
 Rhythm Incarnate 3,706 posts   |
Why not make this a guideline? there are many cases that an appropriate mapping make the things this rule prevent be much, much, much fun to play.
Add the hold circles and the hold sliders feature... isn't that simple? To peoples who are in a pinch or so. You can freely request my help. I just like to hear peoples thankfulness.
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 osu!dev 4,467 posts  |
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Rhythm Incarnate 3,706 posts |
AIMod can sometime barf with a well-done slider too, actually. I remember modding one map where the AIMod said it, but the slider played in a cool way...
SPOILER (click to toggle) You should actually see it before saying anything but yes... that one you posted would be unplayable To peoples who are in a pinch or so. You can freely request my help. I just like to hear peoples thankfulness.
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Rhythm Incarnate 3,706 posts |
Ah, this one is contained here
Quote: Every slider must have a clear and visible path to follow from start to end. Sliders which overlap themselves in a way that makes any section unreadable or ambiguous (including "burai sliders") cannot be used. This is so that no slider has an appearance that is confusing or impossible for the player to read. Additionally, the slider borders must never be covered up from the slider being packed in too tightly. However, sliders that cross over themselves are fine as long as the borders are clearly visible. the path of the sliders that have a strange path, won't actually even be "clear". So there's actually no need of this To peoples who are in a pinch or so. You can freely request my help. I just like to hear peoples thankfulness.
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Beatmap Appreciation Team 7,717 posts |
HakuNoKaemi wrote: Ah, this one is contained here Quote: Every slider must have a clear and visible path to follow from start to end. Sliders which overlap themselves in a way that makes any section unreadable or ambiguous (including "burai sliders") cannot be used. This is so that no slider has an appearance that is confusing or impossible for the player to read. Additionally, the slider borders must never be covered up from the slider being packed in too tightly. However, sliders that cross over themselves are fine as long as the borders are clearly visible. the path of the sliders that have a strange path, won't actually even be "clear". So there's actually no need of this Actually it is clear, what isn't clear is the speed of the slider which is what this rule is trying to prevent from happening and even if they do heal the scar will remain and nothing will ever be the same |
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Rhythm Incarnate 3,706 posts |
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osu!dev 4,467 posts |
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Rhythm Incarnate 3,706 posts |
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Rhythm Incarnate 2,492 posts |
you have to read velocity. sliders that overlap themselves will change the velocity, and thus become "unreadable" according to haku's rule.
I'm not convinced we need the slider anchor/node rule at all. It's not banning anything that isn't already banned by haku's rule. edit because it's not worth a post: yes I know haku, I just didn't want to type out the name. Last edited by ziin on , edited 1 time in total.
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Rhythm Incarnate 3,706 posts |
 Combo Commander 315 posts  |
I am strongly against this rule.
I've always seen changing slider speeds though crumpled sliders as a nice option to have. Not an "abuse of the hitobject's intended use" but an enhancement. Of course it can also be overdone, making them confusing, but in most cases I've seen, they are an easy-to-read and fun-to-play alternative to changing the slider speed using an inherited section. Actually, they can be even easier to read, because the optical clue is stronger, being a "thicker" slider in addition to the ticks. Maybe even more importantly, they make it possible to change speed mid-slider, which, when used right, is great fun to play while being perfectly readable. For example, take a look at the last slider in Krison's Insane diff on this map, or the slow section after the break in this one. The rule, the way it is currently phrased now and being a rule, would ban these things in the future, which I consider a needless loss. |
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Rhythm Incarnate 3,706 posts |
There's no need for a rule that is contained in another, actually. Needless to say, manipulating speed with slider, burai or even crunched up sliders aren't abuse of the object intended use but, correct use of the pbject intended use (giving a feel of the part the slider is following by making use of some particular shapes).
Quote: Slider anchors/nodes must not be used to manipulate slider speeds (whether they are normal nodes or red ones). Using extra nodes to make a slider "wiggle" is usually fine, but using so many that the slider gets scrunched up (which also makes the sliderball go crazy) or become a "hold slider" is abuse of the hitobject's intended use and is not allowed. AIMod (shortcut ctrl+shift+a) will also point out sliders that move in an "abnormal" way, so make sure to check that if you're unsure of a slider. + Quote: Every slider must have a clear and visible path to follow from start to end. Sliders which overlap themselves in a way that makes any section unreadable or ambiguous (including "burai sliders") cannot be used. This is so that no slider has an appearance that is confusing or impossible for the player to read. Additionally, the slider borders must never be covered up from the slider being packed in too tightly. However, sliders that cross over themselves are fine as long as the borders are clearly visible. = Quote: Sliders have to be readable by just seeing the path and/or listening to the music. Slider which move in an way that is ambiguos to the eye and to the ear cannot be used, as their appearance will be needlessly confusing to play. AIMod do point out some sldier that move in a really abnormal way, and giv eyou a way to check if you're using strange sliders. To peoples who are in a pinch or so. You can freely request my help. I just like to hear peoples thankfulness.
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