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This beatmap was submitted using in-game submission on October 19, 2017 at 12:24:10 PM

Artist: Tomita Miyu, Onishi Saori, Ohzora Naomi, Hanazawa Kana
Title: Gabriel Drop Kick
Source: ガヴリールドロップアウト
Tags: Kalibe SnowNiNo_ Karen dropout gabdro dropkick ガヴドロ opening full size tenma gabriel white 天真・ガヴリール・ホワイト tsukinose vignette april 月乃瀬・ヴィネット・エイプリル vigne ヴィーネ kurumizawa satanichia mcdowell 胡桃沢・サタニキア・マクドウェル satania サターニャ shiraha raphiel ainsworth 白羽・ラフィエル・エインズワース
BPM: 168
Filesize: 7500kb
Play Time: 03:24
Difficulties Available:

Download: Tomita Miyu, Onishi Saori, Ohzora Naomi, Hanazawa Kana - Gabriel Drop Kick
Information: Scores/Beatmap Listing
---------------
opening (TV) | opening (Full) | ending (TV) | ending (Full)
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please redownload if you had this mapset before Oct 18, 2017

Hard by Karen
Insane by Kalibe
Extra by SnowNiNo_

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Last edited by Doormat on , edited 97 times in total.
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xxdeathx wrote:

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Ranking Criteria wrote:
Uninherited (red) Timing Sections should be used to accurately map the song's timing. They should synchronize to the beats of the song as accurately as possible and use the correct time signature whenever possible. If an incorrect time signature would last for more than 2 bars, add another timing section to fix it. Please see this thread for more information on downbeats.

00:59:047 - starting here (6/4 336bpm or 2/4 112bpm)
01:03:332 - until here (4/4 168bpm)

There are 4 bars of this so it definitely violates the RC if you plan to go for rank on this. Switching to double bpm will fix the downbeats but having 6 less red lines in the map is going to cause your offset to drift quite a bit less throughout the map so you will have to resnap a bunch of stuff even though in theory all the snaps should be the same.

Similarly in the other 2 places this section repeats of course.

This change puts the section at 8 measures which follows the structure of the rest of the song (2 phrases per section). This gives us:
02:07:618 - Measure 1 (4/4)
02:09:047 - Measure 2 (4/4)
02:10:475 - Measure 3 (6/8)
02:11:546 - Measure 4 (6/8)
02:12:618 - Measure 5 (6/8)
02:13:690 - Measure 6 (6/8)
02:14:761 - Measure 7 (4/4)
02:16:190 - Measure 8 (4/4)

Note that you can hear a slight accent on the vocals for every other beat. Even though the there are 2 groups of 3 by pitch.

02:14:761 (1,2,1) - This was causing me some initial confusion and then I turned off effects. Without the symbol hitsound it's much easier to not confuse it with a downbeat.

Edit: FIXED

P.S. I needed an excuse to listen to this song a bunch. :^)

P.S.S Useful information on how one goes about deciphering this correctly: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musical_form
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chainpullz wrote:
Ranking Criteria wrote:
Uninherited (red) Timing Sections should be used to accurately map the song's timing. They should synchronize to the beats of the song as accurately as possible and use the correct time signature whenever possible. If an incorrect time signature would last for more than 2 bars, add another timing section to fix it. Please see this thread for more information on downbeats.

00:59:047 - starting here (6/4 336bpm or 2/4 112bpm)
01:03:332 - until here (4/4 168bpm) there is no point in the song where it goes to 336 bpm, this is a really stupid idea. using 6/4 at such a high bpm complicates the matters even further (due to the nightcore beats) and the song isn't 112 bpm either

There are 4 bars of this so it definitely violates the RC if you plan to go for rank on this. Switching to double bpm will fix the downbeats but having 6 less red lines in the map is going to cause your offset to drift quite a bit less throughout the map so you will have to resnap a bunch of stuff even though in theory all the snaps should be the same.

Similarly in the other 2 places this section repeats of course.

This change puts the section at 8 measures which follows the structure of the rest of the song (2 phrases per section). This gives us:
02:07:618 - Measure 1 (4/4)
02:09:047 - Measure 2 (4/4)
02:10:475 - Measure 3 (6/8)
02:11:546 - Measure 4 (6/8)
02:12:618 - Measure 5 (6/8)
02:13:690 - Measure 6 (6/8)
02:14:761 - Measure 7 (4/4)
02:16:190 - Measure 8 (4/4)

Note that you can hear a slight accent on the vocals for every other beat. Even though the there are 2 groups of 3 by pitch.

02:14:761 (1,2,1) - This was causing me some initial confusion and then I turned off effects. Without the symbol hitsound it's much easier to not confuse it with a downbeat.

Edit: FIXED

P.S. I needed an excuse to listen to this song a bunch. :^)

P.S.S Useful information on how one goes about deciphering this correctly: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musical_form


thanks for the concern, but quite frankly it's impractical to use 336 bpm when the song isn't 336 bpm at all. the timing at the points you mentioned actually have a 9/8 time signature, which is impossible to recreate using osu!'s timing system. the compromise that was made was two metronome resets at 00:59:047 - and 01:00:654 - (for the first buildup part, every other buildup part follows the same idea), with a time signature of 5/4 so the downbeats don't get repeated. regardless, each red timing point at the entire section that you pointed out is less than two bars long, and fits the requirements of resetting the metronome in order to sync the timing to the beat of the song.

tl;dr you might want to check the map again because the current timing setup isn't breaking the RC from what i can tell. it's done the way it is because of the 9/8 time signature that is impossible to replicate in osu! your suggestion completely de-synchronizes the beat since the song doesn't double in bpm or decrease in bpm.
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I may just be misunderstanding the words "fix it" as fix the time signature, not the downbeat and if so that is my mistake.

The numbers don't add up for it to be 9/8. As much as it sounds like it's 9/8 because of the pitches, it's most definitely 6/8 because this is the only way the total number of measures for the section even makes sense. Sections with 7 measures are rarely ever used in music.

The only time you end up with an odd number of measures is when the transition into the next section requires an extra measure (ie. 9th measure here 03:03:332 - ). This, however, would imply that the section as a whole has 6 measures. The first two measures very clearly represent their own phrase. This would leave 4 measures implying we have 2 phrases. If this were 9/8 the 2nd phrase would start here (01:02:261 - ). But this measure very clearly isn't 9/8. Even if it were two measures of 9/8 and one measure of 6/8, the change from 6/8 to 4/4 would occur mid phrase.

As I have outlined above, the structure here very clearly follows a 4 phrase section (4/4 phrase, 2 6/8 phrases, then another 4/4 phrase). This puts the time signature changes at the start of a new phrase which makes a lot more sense. 8 measures is also the most common number of measures to have in a section which further supports my point.

Lastly, bpm does not affect how you count a piece. In the case of 336 bpm 6/8 you would simply count it in 2 and mentally subdivide to get the 6 beats. Thus why 112bpm would be fitting but 336bpm would be most correct (because the 8 means that eighth notes "get the beat" and it's "beats per minute"). In fact, when the timing is given for these sorts of sections they usually don't give it in beats per minute. They'll give it in dotted quarter notes per minute which is 1/3 what the true bpm is.
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TL;DR: Your measure resets may sound right and you can wave your hands all you want that it's 9/8 because it sounds that way but the math doesn't support that. You may be right that this is still good enough for ranked though. *shrugs*
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chainpullz wrote:
I may just be misunderstanding the words "fix it" as fix the time signature, not the downbeat and if so that is my mistake.

The numbers don't add up for it to be 9/8. As much as it sounds like it's 9/8 because of the pitches, it's most definitely 6/8 because this is the only way the total number of measures for the section even makes sense. Sections with 7 measures are rarely ever used in music.

The only time you end up with an odd number of measures is when the transition into the next section requires an extra measure (ie. 9th measure here 03:03:332 - ). This, however, would imply that the section as a whole has 6 measures. The first two measures very clearly represent their own phrase. This would leave 4 measures implying we have 2 phrases. If this were 9/8 the 2nd phrase would start here (01:02:261 - ). But this measure very clearly isn't 9/8. Even if it were two measures of 9/8 and one measure of 6/8, the change from 6/8 to 4/4 would occur mid phrase.

As I have outlined above, the structure here very clearly follows a 4 phrase section (4/4 phrase, 2 6/8 phrases, then another 4/4 phrase). This puts the time signature changes at the start of a new phrase which makes a lot more sense. 8 measures is also the most common number of measures to have in a section which further supports my point.

Lastly, bpm does not affect how you count a piece. In the case of 336 bpm 6/8 you would simply count it in 2 and mentally subdivide to get the 6 beats. Thus why 112bpm would be fitting but 336bpm would be most correct (because the 8 means that eighth notes "get the beat" and it's "beats per minute"). In fact, when the timing is given for these sorts of sections they usually don't give it in beats per minute. They'll give it in dotted quarter notes per minute which is 1/3 what the true bpm is.
Image

TL;DR: Your measure resets may sound right and you can wave your hands all you want that it's 9/8 because it sounds that way but the math doesn't support that. You may be right that this is still good enough for ranked though. *shrugs*

to address the first bolded point, it can't be a 6/8 time signature because then the emphasis and stresses in the music don't line up with a 6/8 time signature. i'd argue that it's not dependent on whether or not the "math makes sense", but rather it's more dependent on how the song feels. since the emphasis and stresses are more in line with a 9/8 time signature for two measures, i opted to use what i currently employed instead.

to address the second point, it's more-so how the song doesn't change bpm in any form. bpm and time signature both critically affect the way you count a map. for example, let's take your example of 336 bpm:

  • at 336 bpm with a /4 time signature, the number of seconds-per-beat would be 0.1786
  • with a /8 time signature, the number of seconds-per-beat would be 0.0893
  • with a 6/8 time signature, every measure would clock in at about 0.5358 seconds per measure

with 168 bpm:
  • at 168 bpm with a /4 time signature, the number of seconds-per-beat would be 0.3571
  • with a /8 time signature, the number of seconds-per-beat would be 0.1786
  • with a 6/8 time signature, every measure would clock in at about 1.0716 seconds

you would need around two measures of 336 bpm with 6/8 time signature to accommodate for one measure at 168 bpm with 6/8 time signature. pretty obvious math here, but this fundamentally changes the feel of the map. why would a section be timed at double the bpm if you're just going to map every other beat? it might as well just stay at the original bpm. a bpm shift would imply that there is a change in how the number of beats are being counted. if the way the number of beats are counted remains the same, which in this case it does, then a bpm shift doesn't seem feasible.
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ok, all diffs are finished and the set is now ready for mods!

edit (03.25): changed background zzz
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new bg was NICE >~<
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I want to live my life like Vigne but I slowly behave like Gab everyday tfw i liked the old bg


Doormat’s Easy

00:25:474 (2) – Can play with slider body a bit to fix blanket like that or smth
00:39:760 (2) – Make spacing look more even between 00:39:046 (1,3) – ?
01:25:118 (2) – Fix blanket
02:17:618 (1,2,3) – Can make triangle nicer with ds like that
02:31:189 (2,3,4) – A triangle here would look nicer imo, just move 02:33:332 (5) – if you do make it


Normal

00:21:189 (7,1) – Fix stack :d
01:20:832 (2,3) – I think it would like nicer if 01:21:190 (3) – was angled lower like that or similar to 01:21:547 (4,5) – angle
01:39:761 (5,6,1) – Can make triangle more even by moving 01:40:475 (1) – up
01:51:190 (1) – Fix blanket, can change 01:50:118 (3) – body a little and then use same body and paste over 01:49:404 (2) – so it remains identical
02:24:760 (3) – Fix blanket
02:29:760 (3,4) – Same spacing as 02:29:403 (2,3) – just copy paste


Angel & Devil

00:10:475 (1,2,3,4,5) – Looks pretty similar to what you did in the tv size :d
00:12:617 (7,8,9) – I think it would look nicer as a triangle plays fine still either way
00:21:189 (3,1) – Fix stack :d
00:22:439 (2,3,4) – Can make triangle more even if you were going for one here
00:24:046 (3,1) – Fix stack
00:31:546 (4) – Tbh you can space this a bit further from 00:31:189 (3)
00:41:189 (5) – Make slider more like this for better blanket :d, still plays the same
00:47:082 (2,1) – Fix stack ok I’mma just let you find stacks if there are more :x
01:07:261 (4) – I think a stronger curve would accent 01:06:904 (3) – this better
01:08:868 (8) – This drop seems kind of high tbh, you can move it up and make a star pattern or smth
02:06:904 (1,2,3,4,5) – I think spacing can be a bit higher for emphasis, also space 02:07:261 (4) – further away from 02:06:725 (6) – looks nicer imo
02:26:010 (8,9) – You do a lot of overlapping in the jumps, why not have a half overlap here or something instead of having it stick out? Like this or something
02:41:189 (4) – Should be more spaced away from the blanket at 02:41:546 (2) – imo
03:03:868 (4,5,6,7) – Vocals are unique here, I think you can do a different pattern here as well to go with the song instead of ds

Nice set and song! Rank it please :d
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Angel & Devil
00:20:474 (1,2,3) - would be nice to soft finish them, sounds better imo
00:34:224 (4) - maybe remove this circle and stack 00:34:046 (3,5) - for nice effect with vocals
02:34:582 (3) - there is nothing special in this circle to highlight it with such spacing, reduce it
02:42:350 (3) - i cant hear this slider. i hear 1/3 piano here but nothing on blue tick, unlike this 02:43:064 (7) - so change it to 1/3


NiNo's Extra
nice


Kalibe's Insane
http://i.imgur.com/QEMicZQ.png xd


Karen's Hard
01:16:190 (1) - hp bar


Normal
00:39:046 (1) - slightly on hp bar


Easy
look http://i.imgur.com/2dbDVnQ.png http://i.imgur.com/auwaRfV.png SAME FOR NORMAL and high diff
00:31:189 (2) - slightly touching hp bar
01:20:118 (4) - ^
02:13:690 (1) - ^



otherwise everything is fine o.o!
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Kyle73 wrote:
I want to live my life like Vigne but I slowly behave like Gab everyday tfw i liked the old bg


Doormat’s Easy

00:25:474 (2) – Can play with slider body a bit to fix blanket like that or smth fixed
00:39:760 (2) – Make spacing look more even between 00:39:046 (1,3) – ? looks fine to me
01:25:118 (2) – Fix blanket assume all blankets after this point are also fixed
02:17:618 (1,2,3) – Can make triangle nicer with ds like that i tried
02:31:189 (2,3,4) – A triangle here would look nicer imo, just move 02:33:332 (5) – if you do make it agreed


Normal

00:21:189 (7,1) – Fix stack :d assume all stacks are fixed too lol
01:20:832 (2,3) – I think it would like nicer if 01:21:190 (3) – was angled lower like that or similar to 01:21:547 (4,5) – angle made them the same angle
01:39:761 (5,6,1) – Can make triangle more even by moving 01:40:475 (1) – up this is already a triangle with equal 120 degree angles though???
01:51:190 (1) – Fix blanket, can change 01:50:118 (3) – body a little and then use same body and paste over 01:49:404 (2) – so it remains identical blanket here looks fine, though. check again
02:24:760 (3) – Fix blanket
02:29:760 (3,4) – Same spacing as 02:29:403 (2,3) – just copy paste they are the same spacing, snap distance is just being stupid and giving different values


Angel & Devil

00:10:475 (1,2,3,4,5) – Looks pretty similar to what you did in the tv size :d purely coincidental and not that big of a problem imo. there are bound to be similarities since i map them in a similar manner
00:12:617 (7,8,9) – I think it would look nicer as a triangle plays fine still either way the larger spacing is to emphasize the slight pause in the piano
00:21:189 (3,1) – Fix stack :d
00:22:439 (2,3,4) – Can make triangle more even if you were going for one here yea
00:24:046 (3,1) – Fix stack
00:31:546 (4) – Tbh you can space this a bit further from 00:31:189 (3) i think current spacing is fine; maybe if more people suggest this though
00:41:189 (5) – Make slider more like this for better blanket :d, still plays the same
00:47:082 (2,1) – Fix stack ok I’mma just let you find stacks if there are more :x
01:07:261 (4) – I think a stronger curve would accent 01:06:904 (3) – this better i tried
01:08:868 (8) – This drop seems kind of high tbh, you can move it up and make a star pattern or smth i think the spacing here is fine,
actually. vocals come to a pause on the (9) so the end of the patterning here has slightly higher spacing to emphasize that

02:06:904 (1,2,3,4,5) – I think spacing can be a bit higher for emphasis, also space 02:07:261 (4) – further away from 02:06:725 (6) – looks nicer imo agreed
02:26:010 (8,9) – You do a lot of overlapping in the jumps, why not have a half overlap here or something instead of having it stick out? Like this or something honestly i don't think it matters here because the previous notes will have faded away completely by the time these new notes will have come into play, so it has no effect on the aesthetics of the map; it's just how i want the movement to be done
02:41:189 (4) – Should be more spaced away from the blanket at 02:41:546 (2) – imo k
03:03:868 (4,5,6,7) – Vocals are unique here, I think you can do a different pattern here as well to go with the song instead of ds i'm following the harpsichord here because this part loops to make up for satania's mistake in the song. therefore i wanted the patterning to be similar to 03:01:903 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9) -

Nice set and song! Rank it please :d


Mirash wrote:

Angel & Devil
00:20:474 (1,2,3) - would be nice to soft finish them, sounds better imo i think normal sampleset is more effective; there are no cymbal crashes here so soft finish would sound out of place imo
00:34:224 (4) - maybe remove this circle and stack 00:34:046 (3,5) - for nice effect with vocals i like the current movement here, and it fits the instrumentals pretty well, so i want to keep this pattern
02:34:582 (3) - there is nothing special in this circle to highlight it with such spacing, reduce it reduced by a bit
02:42:350 (3) - i cant hear this slider. i hear 1/3 piano here but nothing on blue tick, unlike this 02:43:064 (7) - so change it to 1/3 it's following piano here. piano sounds like it lands on a blue tick more than the 1/3 imo, just like at the beginning 00:10:921 (3) -


Normal
00:39:046 (1) - slightly on hp bar lowered


Easy
look http://i.imgur.com/2dbDVnQ.png http://i.imgur.com/auwaRfV.png SAME FOR NORMAL and high diff fixed for all diffs, thanks for noticing
00:31:189 (2) - slightly touching hp bar
01:20:118 (4) - ^
02:13:690 (1) - ^
all fixed~



otherwise everything is fine o.o!


thanks for the mods! @Mirash i'll get to your map soon

@GDers i also updated the bg again to something less questionable, map needs another redownload zzz
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Hi from my mod queue :-)

Doormat's Easy
Nothing found - perhaps change the difficulty name to just "Easy"?

Normal
00:35:117 (4) - A smaller reverse slider fits the song better here.

Karen's Hard
02:08:868 (6) - I prefer a note here on the strong sound.

Kalibe's Insane
01:39:761 (2) - I generally prefer ctrl+g on this note on these type of sliders.

NiNo's Extra
02:04:313 (4) - Needs snapping.

Notes
WOW NiNo, this map impresses me! extremely well mapped!

Angel & Devil
01:48:332 (2) - Just preference but I prefer ctrl+g on this.

Overall
Great mapping guys! I love it, very nice! :-)
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@CircleFairy the Easy is named [Doormat's Easy] to avoid metadata conflicts with my TV size since they share the same artist/title.

Normal: i'm following instrumentals there, so i think it's okay to use a 1/1 slider instead

Extra: for 01:48:332 (2) - it's intentionally placed this way for the pattern structure i want.

for future reference, i think your mod needs to be more in depth, but it's not bad for a beginner modder. thanks for taking a look~
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